Ayurveda, Inflammation, and Hashimoto’s: A Different Way to Understand Your Thyroid with Dr. Shivani Gupta

Inna (00:00.109)

Okay. Well, we’ll do Dr. Shabani. think it’s… You went to school for it. You studied hard. This is… Yeah. Okay. Perfect.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (00:00.738)

Just Shavani is fine. Yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (00:06.638)

I did, did, anything’s fine.

Inna (00:15.617)

Dr. Shivani, I am so excited to have you on the show. Welcome to Thyroid Mystery Salve, Toshimoto’s and Hypothyroidism Revealed.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (00:23.512)

Thank you, thanks for having me.

Inna (00:25.509)

so excited for our conversation. So when it comes to Hashimoto’s, I think that most people already know that it’s not really a thyroid problem per se, at least not at first, but it’s really an immune confusion problem that causes the thyroid to get attacked and become destroyed over time and become slow. And the root lies in inflammation and there’s various triggers that can create that inflammation and affect that inflammation. Your specialty is.

Ayurvedic medicine and addressing inflammation and many, different diseases from this point. And it’s a little bit different that I think than most people maybe understand or are aware of. So tell us more about this word. What is Ayurveda and how do we look at inflammation from that perspective?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (01:12.696)

For sure. So Ayurveda is this ancient system of medicine, health and healing from India that’s over 5,000 years old. So if you’ve heard of acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine, in that system there is so many similarities around how they look at the body as a system, our meridians are all interconnected, and our goal is really to bring flow back into the body and remove anything that’s creating friction. And so in the same way, in Ayurveda,

We taught that the goal is to bring body, mind, and spirit into alignment. And we do that by getting the body so healthy, fixing any struggles that are going on, bringing in that alignment, and then also our mental, emotional health so that we can have that spiritual joy, that high states of joy and happiness that we all deserve to have. And so in Ayurveda, we reach into a couple of different toolkits. We first teach you about your elemental design. What are the elements that you are made of primarily?

And how does that dictate your body type, your mental type, your emotional type? And it’s kind of in the driver’s seat around how you can manage your life. Angshan Ayurveda called it the doshas. And in my new book, I wanted to create systems where we could really use it in the West. And so I renamed it and translated it into elemental design and then applied it into all aspects of how we apply self-care. Then Ayurveda came up with the circadian clock.

So nowadays we talk so much about circadian lifestyle medicine and Ayurveda took that circadian clock that it came up with and gave us much deeper frameworks around how to apply them. And then Ayurveda considers gut health the center of all health, our immune health, our vitality, everything, our mental health all comes from the gut. And so we have a lot of teachings around honoring the gut on a daily basis as the central fire within us that is the key to everything else.

Then we teach super spices, what I call our mindful medicine chest. The spices we can reach for as we need them, whether it’s part of our daily ritual or the remedies that we need to support ourselves. And then we also teach something called dinacharya, the daily self-care rituals you live by that help you build your circadian clock, circadian rhythm, but also keep the body detoxed and supported because we have a tendency to have a toxic burden in the system now more than ever.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (03:32.814)

that’s causing all sorts of issues. And as I wrote my book, by the end of it, by the time I taught this system and these six pillars of Ayurveda, I realized, you know what, if I don’t highlight this last piece, I’m not doing service to my audience and my reader. And so I wanted to explain that stress alone can cause physical inflammation, that physical inflammation can drive that mental inflammation. And so I was sitting and I sat with the universe and I was like, I need a phrase for this.

And the phrase that came to me was mental inflammation. And so that’s also something I like to talk about, which is all that undercurrent of stress, how it alone can cause the inflammation that we’re doing so much good stuff to avoid and get rid of it. But that one last piece is our last frontier that we still have to address as well.

Inna (04:20.147)

I love that. And that’s such a big part, that last piece especially, for so many people because, and I love your term, mental inflammation. I can resonate and relate to this so much and I know that everyone listening can as well. We don’t think of it that way, but it’s like, I almost want to keep saying mental inflammation, like that, wow, you know?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (04:39.906)

And it brings awareness, right? Like so many of us are creating these high impact, really busy lives. And so whenever I have those moments where I’m super stressed, I’m like, that’s mental inflammation. Do you want to cause physical inflammation? And I’ll say, no, I don’t. Okay, then calm down. Like settle down. What do you need to write down? What do you need to break into pieces? What is the tool you need to pick up right now so that this doesn’t implant itself as physical inflammation in your system?

And when we talk about thyroid health, your key topic, one thing we underestimate as how mental inflammation is this root driver of our thyroid issues because so many of us are sitting in fight or flight, we’re stressed 24 seven. I go through seasons sometimes where I’m stressed in my sleep. I wake up and I know I’ve been grinding and my tongue is like pushing on my teeth and I wake up and I’m like, why is this sore?

you were dreaming about your business and your work and your sleep. You didn’t even let sleep be relaxing for you. And so that’s where I like to highlight we can build rhythms and certain breaks into our day into slices of time to help decompress that mental inflammation and keep coming back to our baseline so that we’re not sitting in that fight or flight stress level all the time. And one simple tool I use for that, practical tool, so I love to share what we can really do about this.

I share something called tea time as me time. So I pause and have a cup of tea four to five times a day just to settle down and take a moment and take a breath, tune into my intuition. It can be a mindful moment or an anchor moment, but it’s a way to check in with yourself and say, you know, how am I doing today? What do I need to do for today to be better? How can I shift today so it’s better for me?

And my own intuition will come through with answers like, need to cancel that, you need to change that, you can’t say no to everything. And that’s where we start to lift up that load of mental inflammation.

Inna (06:36.333)

The intuition part is really important and I think so many people think about the fact that they don’t have intuition. I know that was me many years ago. like, I don’t have intuition. What are you talking about? But, you know, and even someone who wants to harness that intuition, the way you do that isn’t to necessarily practice and work hard. It’s actually to slow down and to have that cup of tea. So I love that so much. Now let’s talk about the body types. This is something that I know a lot of people find really interesting. I’ve studied this.

a little bit a long time ago. But I would love to dig into that in the doshas. How would someone, well, first of tell us about the different ones and then how would someone go about finding it and how is that specifically helpful in Hashimoto’s?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (07:20.792)

For sure. So ancient Ayurveda told us that nature is made of five elements. And we are made of those five elements. So they are air, ether, fire, water, and earth. And when you look at those elements of nature that exist in all of nature and exist in us, we as humans, when we’re born, have a certain body constitution. And you can see that. In science, we’ve talked about mesomorph, ectomorph, different body types that exist.

Nowadays we’re studying genetics and how our genetics are different and how we have certain classifications of different groups. And so in ancient Ayurveda, we classified everyone into vata, pitta, and gaffa. And you can pronounce them vata, pitta, and kaffa here in the West, if that’s easier. And so these body types illuminate that there’s a body type called air and ether. That’s your vata person. A pitta person’s fire with water. And then finally, gaffa is earth and water.

And we’re all born with our primary and secondary body constitution. And some people are balanced in all three. And so when I describe these, start to listen for which one you think is you. The first one, which is called Vata, is a body type of air and ether. So imagine if air is out there, it’s a beautiful breeze. Could be a beautiful feeling. Could be a ceiling fan, always in motion, never stops. Or it could be a tornado. Could have this violent, crazy energy and be all over the place.

And so a Vata person physically tends to be taller or shorter than most people in their demographic. So tall and lanky, small and petite, smaller boned. This is someone who tends to have small eyes, a more oval face, can tend to have dry, brittle hair. This is someone who’s drier. They’re colder, like that air that’s always in motion. Their energy is always in motion. I know, right? It’s pretty classic and it’s interesting to note that.

Inna (09:05.143)

think every thyroid person is going to raise their hand.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (09:12.256)

And so when you’re talking about a Vata person, they’re always moving. This is someone who doesn’t really want to sit still. So they’ll even lean towards jobs that allow them to move more, or they’re going to make time to be an endurance runner or endurance athlete because they have that energy that they want to move. And so when it comes to Vata people, some of their imbalances include insomnia, dryness, joints, dry joints, and joint pain, joint aches and pains. They can have a tendency towards constipation.

because of dryness in the colon, and then a tendency towards anxiety because their energy is always in motion, and if they’re not grounded, that energy can turn into anxiety. They can be perceived as a busy body who just never stops moving around and doing things. And they can also have palpitations, and because of that movement in the system, they can have irregular hormones. So it is a thyroid pattern as well when we look at it through that lens. And so what the people, the homework is,

Let’s do everything to ground that energy. What’s interesting about what the people that I forgot to mention is they can run through the whole day, usually without eating a real meal. So this is your crew that’s like, I had green juice, I had my coffee, I had some chips, I had some celery, green juice, and I’m fine. And by the time they hit dinner, they’re like, why do I have no gas in the tank? I’m so tired, I just don’t feel good. And it’s cause they forgot to eat, which is unique to that body constitution. And so our homework for Vata is grounding.

grounding foods, root vegetables, everything you do in the fall to stay grounded applies to vata, because fall is a vata season. And then we also want three square meals a day with healthy fat, which is actually pretty hard. It sounds easy for many of us, but for a vata person, you are asking them to do something very unnatural. But what it does is it brings them into more grounded state, and they start to finish what they start. They start to feel more settled. They’re more clear in their mind.

It just brings harmony into their system. Then you have the fifth accrue. Bitha is fire. So this is someone who’s medium bodied But that will be more tall and lanky or small and petite guffa in on the other spectrum is gonna be sturdier and strong So this is someone who’s medium bodied Maybe a more athletic build tend to have reddish skin reddish hair tend to have early graying in their hair So I’m a bit that it says yeah, and most podcasters who I meet our pit that’s because it’s that personality

Inna (11:30.221)

That me too, I think.

Interesting. And that’s so interesting. You also say early gray hair. I have that too, but I never realized that that was a connection to that.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (11:37.26)

the type that would do this work, who gets…

Dr. Shivani Gupta (11:45.122)

Yes, early green. We’re so fiery. It’s like we burn the fires out all the time. We’re going faster than most people do. And so we burn through so much energy in our own system. So, bit the fires tend to be hangry. We have a big appetite and we have a digestive fire that allows for that consumption of everything in life. Not just food, but information, data, learning, friendship. We are consumers of the world.

Biddas tend to be passionate, organized, leaders, driven. Like this is someone who’s a go-getter and they’re gonna go after what they want. They’re sharp and they’re speaking. Their imbalances tend to be that because they are such a fire type, they tend to get inflamed. They tend to be kind of like a volcano. They erupt, get angry, get frustrated, burn out, take their anger out on everyone around them. I know, exactly.

We look so sweet on the outside, but if you’re our family, you know the truth of like that anger that can come out if we’re not well balanced. And so my homework for the Bitha crew is really staying hydrated, cool, calm, collected. Treat yourself like a nuclear reactor and really do the patterns that support you. So it’s those summer foods, coconut water, cooling foods. One thing that’s interesting is sugar has a sweet effect on the inside, which has a cooling effect.

So the vata anxiety crew, vata crew who tends towards anxiety will reach for sugar a lot to stay cool and calm, and the pitas are gonna reach for sugar a lot to stay cool and calm. And so it’s just important to pay attention. Pitas tend towards eating hot, spicy foods, oily, fried foods, and these keep them out of balance. And our job is to eat the more cooling foods and the whole foods that keep us balanced without reaching for sugar, alcohol, caffeine, those things that cause the imbalances. And then finally you have gaffa.

Scufa is earth and water. So this crew is the earthy crew. They tend to have round face, round eyes, oily curly hair, oilier skin, more luscious. This is someone who’s sturdier. They can lift heavier. They have a stronger constitution. They tend to be very one thing at a time. So talking one thing at a time, one step at a time. They can tend towards having a sluggish metabolism, low mood, depression.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (14:09.708)

they are the caretakers of the rest of us. So this is the kindest friend in your circle. In a man, it can feel like a very mountain grounded energy. You’re not gonna move their energy. In a woman, it can feel like someone who’s so grandma caretaker loving energy towards everyone around her. And so when it comes to Kapha, they can tend towards having these autoimmune flares, can tend towards inflammation. They can tend towards that sluggish metabolism, that weight gain.

And also fatigue, like a low mood. And so our job is to support Guffa and say, let’s get your energy moving first thing in the morning. Find a friend who’s willing to work out with you or try new things, because you might not be into trying new things. Let’s eat more cooked foods that are easy to digest. Let’s avoid dairy, because dairy is going to be sluggish for the system. And it’ll cause more congestion, because that water energy is very present in them. And then let’s do the things we need to to keep our energy moving and set good boundaries with our loved ones.

our tendency is to give, give, give and not take care of ourselves. And so looking at that, you might realize, you know, I think I was a Bitta growing up and I had Vatha, but then I had kids and my life shifted and I became so Kaffa or I became a caretaker and I became more Kaffa, which I see a lot in women. And so it’s just about paying attention to where are you at? What were you when you were born? And then where are you in balance now? And how can we bring your body back into your alignment?

And so I have an elemental design quiz on my website at drshamani.com. And when people take the quiz, they will email me back and they’re like, how did you know that about me? That is insane. And I’m like, this is ancient wisdom. I just get to be the teacher of it. And it highlights to us how our body type works. So as I fit that person, I really have to self-manage. I can’t skip my meals. I can tend to burn out and cause my own autoimmune flares.

Inna (15:45.709)

you

Inna (15:49.612)

Right.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (16:02.092)

because I will push everything aside in my life for work, because I want to. And that’s how we can kind of understand where do we tend towards imbalance and how do we keep it more balanced.

Inna (16:11.393)

Yeah, that’s great. That’s great. mean, I can resonate so much with this, so much of what you said for Pita, which is me, or at least one of the primary, I could resonate with a lot there. for everyone listening, I know you have a lot more in your book as well about how people can figure that out. Now, does astrology play role in this at all in terms of like if you’re an air sign or a fire sign, or is that not related?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (16:36.216)

You know, in IRB, though, we very much believe in Jyotish astrology and astrology and how that plays a role. So yes, your constitution is decided at the moment of your birth. It’s the combination of your parents, combination of the environment you’re in, and certainly that can play a role as well, because it is a deciding factor in who and what you are. So I am a Sagittarius fire sign, and then I am all fire. And so it’s interesting when you correlate that and you’re like, wow, I really have to do the work.

to stay balanced, because my tendency is to go overboard all the time.

Inna (17:11.501)

And it’s so nice for people to understand that once they know their body type and their type, it’s not a negative. It’s just knowing that and using that and then really just working with it. And it sounds like there’s, of course, a lot of biochemical things like some of the food things that you mentioned and the timing, but also the emotional piece of it that’s so important that we can’t ignore.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (17:32.256)

Exactly, and I think self-knowledge, self-awareness, self-understanding really helps. Because if I was primarily Vata and I had this tendency towards kind of being in motion all the time and having this busy body type of energy, then I could understand, you know, I need more decompression. I really need to build and honor those bigger breaks in my day. I need to know when that feeling is rising up that I could easily reach for like a latte or something that weighs me down a little to balance myself.

or I as a Bitta have such an awareness that my whole being just wants to work until I burn out. And so I always have to catch those burnout moments and pull them back very consciously and understand, okay, if you want to run your life at that pace, you’re going to create autoimmune conditions. You’re going to create such inflammation in your system. And this is your passion to teach about it. So you can’t do that. You have to build in the breaks for yourself, really invest in winning at that inflammation.

And then Guffa as well, really paying attention to, yes, it’s my nature that I’m going to have a great day. I’m going to love everyone. When I sit down on the couch at the end of the day, I am not getting up from that couch. I become glued to it. It’s like Mother Earth sat down at the end of her day. So how do I build a day that’s amazing and productive? But honor, like honor your true nature and honor how you are instead of fighting with yourself. Because oftentimes we’re listening to modern day society that says, we all need side hustles and we need

evening hustles and we need to do everything 24-7. But if we honor self and understand, I’m coming from this template. I now can leverage that and understand what are the things I need the most to feel balanced and have harmony inside of myself, mentally, emotionally, and physically. Then all of a sudden you’re coming from a place of so much power and self understanding.

Inna (19:21.805)

Now, when we think about inflammation as a whole, right, because that’s the root of all of the things. And, you you talked a little bit about the body types and ways to decrease that from all of these angles. Let’s talk a little bit about the herbs, because I know that herbs play such a big role in Ayurvedic medicine. And so tell us more about some of the herbs. I know you’ve researched turmeric specifically, but what I also would love to know, and we can kind of chat about this, is

Do we then use different herbs for different body types as well?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (19:53.23)

Good point, yes. We absolutely can customize the herbs to the body types. There are some that are so good for inflammation that I like to use them across the board. I can’t imagine not giving it to somebody. Turmeric is definitely one of them. When I did my PhD dissertation on it, I just fell so in love with it. I was like, this is incredible that one plant from Mother Nature can have such a multifaceted approach to our health.

And I’m one of those people growing up, I always had an immune system that I thought, gosh, everyone else has an immune system that works and mine doesn’t. And why is that? How am gonna build a robust immune system? And when I learned about Ayurveda and gut health and its herbs, I thought, okay, this is a system that understands I have to do the work. I have to rebuild my immune system year after year and keep it strong and healthy. And so when it comes to turmeric, which is my favorite herb,

What most people don’t know about turmeric is out of the entire turmeric plant, only three to 5 % of it is the curcuminoids. And we know that those curcuminoids are the most effective at reducing inflammation. And like you mentioned, inflammation is a big key topic. We’re starting to see that inflammation is this forest fire within us, causing damage, damaging our organs, and really causing so many struggles and issues. And so…

Inna (21:12.631)

Can you tell us a little bit about how exactly their curcumin part of that, the curcuminoids, how do they lower inflammation? Are they blocking specific inflammatory pathways? Which ones? Just for some people who might be interested in more details.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (21:26.414)

for sure. So that 3 to 5 % of the tumor that is the three curcuminoids, of those three curcuminoids, curcumin is the most effective at reducing inflammation. And so when we talk about the supplement world, there’s many different types of supplements pulling in curcuminoids and curcumin. Curcumin is a modulator of NF-kappa-B. It down regulates TNF-alpha and impacts over 30 different master switches around inflammation. It’s also a very powerful antioxidant.

So it reduces that oxidative stress on our thyroid tissue and on our bodies, but it also reverses that oxidation in the first place. So instead of just addressing what’s in front of it and cleaning up the system after, it’s really preventing that oxidation. It’s also a powerful immune balancer. So turmeric is antibacterial, antiviral, antifungal. So it can help in regulating an autoimmune response in the system. It reduces pro-inflammatory cytokines. So we mentioned TNF-alpha, NF-kappa-B.

but interleukin-6, interleukin-1, these different pathways that affect inflammation. It also supports the reduction in our thyroid antibodies. So I think of turmeric as this support tool that goes in almost like a janitor because it goes in there, it clears out what doesn’t belong, clears out senescent cells, clears out, clears out senescent cells, clears out bacterias that don’t belong while leaving the good in place, causes autophagy.

and cell apoptosis. So really is clearing the system of what doesn’t belong in us, malignant cells as well. So it’s this ultimate janitor in that sense. But then the fact that it goes from such a multifaceted approach towards those inflammatory markers is also powerful. So I read recently about omega-3 and how omega-3 goes after certain pathways in our body of inflammation versus when we’re talking about the plant kingdom like curcumin and turmeric, it goes after the whole spectrum of inflammatory markers.

And I think that’s why what we’re seeing with it is it’s being studied so heavily in so many different issues of the body, joint pain, brain health. It has so many applications for us.

Inna (23:33.675)

And you mentioned also that it can lower thyroid antibodies. Tell us a little bit more about that because for us with Hashimoto’s, this is a big, big topic and always something that we talk about.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (23:43.726)

So it supports that reduction in thyroid antibodies like TPO indirectly through its immune modulation. It is helping calm that systemic inflammation that drives our thyroid tissue damage. And again, it is protecting against that oxidative stress. And so it has this very multifactorial approach and it’s been interesting to work with turmeric and work with doctors over the last decade. What they tell me is when the patient comes in with like a big issue, let’s say it’s like back pain, hip pain.

It helps with that first. Then it goes after the medium size issue and then the smaller issues. Like patients will come in and say, my allergies, my gingivitis, like littler issues. And so that’s where I think it’s so beautiful that it goes into the body and the body knows what to do with it. In Ayurveda, we teach so much about using these herbs really strategically and putting them into the system to have that multifaceted support and then stopping taking them. We don’t need to take any given herb every day forever.

It’s really about bringing them in and using them and then being complete with them and having the lifestyle in place so we’re not relying on them all the time.

Inna (24:50.829)

That’s great because that was my next question actually is like, it a long-term thing? But that’s amazing that you can use it short-term. Now when you say short-term, and I understand of course it’s going to vary from person to person, but what is short-term? Are we talking a couple of weeks or a couple of months?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (25:06.082)

You know, I think it depends on the person. So when we’re talking about big issues in people, we’re talking about three months, six month use. If you’re taking it acutely, a lot of times people are using tumor as an acute solution for pain, then you can take it for just that time period, that week or so, to get you out of trouble and then let the body kind of self-regulate and manage from there. I think the big issue is nowadays we’re living in a moment where food is not giving us the vitamins and minerals we need.

water quality is questionable, air quality is questionable. We have this toxic burden in the system that’s rising. And in Ayurveda, we call that toxin residue inside of the system ama. So it’s like this toxin residue that’s forming and it’s interrupting communication. So the body can’t communicate well. We’re in this autoimmune moment where the body is kind of fighting fires on all fronts. Lymphatic system is congested, unable to flow well.

And so all of a sudden you’re dealing with this moment of confusion, congestion, and then we are kicking off inflammation and different struggles. And so to me, using ginger, turmeric, cumin, cinnamon, all the different super spices, fennel, I mean, there’s so many of them. I like to use them on a food level all the time. And then I use them as a strategic herbal solutions, maybe three days a week, four days a week, not relying on them as an everyday solution, but kind of keeping them around and keeping them as support.

because the level of toxicity in the modern day world kind of feels like it is always attacking our system at some level.

Inna (26:38.667)

in terms of the body types, my understanding curcumin is more considered more of a hot herb, right? So if someone is a pita and they already have a lot of fire and redness in their skin, is that something that is safe to use or is that something that they may feel like more of an increase in that heat and fire?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (26:57.24)

Good question. So I have had some people report to me that turmeric is so potent and it’s warming to their system and they feel it. And you’re right, the Vata crew can take the curcumin, they’re fine. Gufa crew can take it, they’re fine. Bithas have to pay a little more attention. But what I tell people is nowadays we’re living in this modern day society where most of us are sitting in air conditioning all day. Like there’s rarely a day where I’m not in my car air conditioned, my house air conditioned, my bed air conditioned. So I don’t consider it as much of an issue now.

But yes, if you are going to go to the beach all day or do a lot of activities that are heating, let’s say it’s a big workout day, things like that, then pay attention because you are adding something heating onto the system and you might need to do something cool with it like coconut water or a fruit that’s cooling like watermelon or summer food in any sort of way to balance out the warmth of it. The issue is, Bithas tend to be inflamed. We tend to do everything inflammatory and cause inflammation in our system. We like those inflammatory foods.

And so I still use it heavily as a bitha, but I just pay attention. If I’m getting really hot and feel the heat rising in my system, I’ll do something cooling to balance it.

Inna (28:07.911)

the supplement itself because there are thousands of curcumin supplements out there. And like you mentioned, it’s the actives are these three curcuminoids that are only 35 % of the full plant. And so I am assuming that there’s probably a very specific process that needs to be used to extract that. And then in terms of potency and viability, you know, it probably needs to stay stable and there’s probably a lot of things that need to happen. So talk to us a little bit about that because

I think people can go to, most people who think they’ll listen to the show know that they’re not gonna go to CVS to get supplements, but they will go to a health food store, right, or Amazon. So how do they know that they’re getting something that is actually potent and viable?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (28:48.738)

You know, the supplement world is pretty crazy. There was a study almost a decade ago by the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal where they picked up supplements off the big box retailer shelf and they found over 75 % of them didn’t have the active ingredient stated. Fast forward to now, people private label and create all sorts of stuff for Amazon and we have no idea where it’s made, who sourced it, or what is actually in those pills. And I have a lot of colleagues in my supplement sector who are actually finding that

their products are adulterated and copied and sold on Amazon, and customers are getting completely fake versions of their products. So I don’t buy any skincare, makeup, or supplements on Amazon. I’m so careful. And I don’t believe in buying our supplements from big box retailers. When it comes to the supplement world right now, there’s, in my opinion, two different groups. There’s who builds a product as cheap as they can and just pushes it out on the market. And it’s about the profit.

And then there’s a whole group of supplements built for the functional medicine, integrative medicine, medical grade space, where we’re really focused on how do we deliver a result? The focus is actually the result for the end user. And so in that world, we have great supplement companies who are creating really potent, incredible products. So if you go to your chiropractor or your acupuncturist or any functional medicine practitioner, they are going to these conferences where

we’re learning the science, the deep science and the current science of all these different herbs, these different ingredients, these different molecules that we’re studying. And so when it comes to curcumin and the curcuminoids, there are a ton of supplements on the market. It’s been a trendy product for almost a decade now. But it’s so important to look at how was it made, why was it made, who is making it. And so in my case, when I finished my PhD, everyone came to me and is like, whose tumor should I take?

And I went to the store and I tried to find one that I could trust. I couldn’t find one. So I said, it’s the Wild Wild West. Just try your best and let me know how they do. And everyone around me encouraged me. They’re like, if you really want to shift Western medicine and orthopedics with turmeric, you should make your own. And so I went to India and I found the most incredible supplier who’s as obsessed with turmeric as I am. And they go through the science of pulling those curcuminoids out of turmeric, mimicking the proportion of mother nature.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (31:04.972)

so that our body knows what to do with that and then takes it and pushes it to a 97 % great potency, the highest we could possibly get, and then gives that to people. So my formula has been out there for 10 years and is used by doctors. And the doctors always call me and they’re like, Shivani, this is insane. My patient came off of X thing that I gave them and is now taking this. And so that I think is the power of taking supplements that are so personalized, so targeted.

that are really part of the precision medicine category that we’re in right now, where we’re creating something that really supports the end user. So that’s my whole world is Turmeric formulas. And all I hear from people is my back pain’s gone, my hip pain’s gone. This is amazing. I don’t get sick as often. I have my energy. I don’t have aches and pains. So to me, Turmeric is a powerful plant when we make it properly and make it at the highest potency and truly mimic Mother Nature.

and pull that extract out in a way that we can use.

Inna (32:05.165)

And that’s great. And that’s so important. And I think probably 98 % of stuff out there doesn’t do any of those steps or is probably missing at least one or two of them. And I think, you know, the extract in the same form as it is in nature, because it’s just so important. I mean, it’s even food. Like we know, like the reason why we absorb nutrients from food is because they’re in this exact, perfect proportion. So that makes sense. Now, what about

in terms of the delivery system. is it a, tell us a little bit more about like liquids versus powders and what people need to look for.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (32:42.616)

Sure, so when I was doing my dissertation, there was no science that was apples to apples comparing turmeric with black pepper and turmeric with a healthy fat. And I tried, I looked, because I was really curious, like which way is better? So we know that turmeric with black pepper, the black pepper increases the absorption by 2000%. And I actually worked in the lab at MD Anderson Cancer Center, Houston, where the scientists discovered that. I worked there in high school. And so when I went back to him when I was doing my PhD,

He’s like, listen, please don’t be one of those people who breaks off a molecule of curcumin, publishes a study and calls it better. Don’t do that. Honor mother nature, that mother nature is the best way forward and honor that. So I ended up only focusing on curcumin with black pepper because of that research that I saw firsthand in front of me. Now we have good science that shows that curcumin with a healthy fat will help it cross the blood brain barrier and do great things. My issue is,

I worry a lot about rancidity when we’re talking about shipping products, we’re talking about heat. I don’t want to ship something to someone’s home and then it’s pro-inflammatory in their system. I don’t want the shelf life issues around that. So what I tell people to be safe is I’m sending you a Veggie Cap product, turmeric with black pepper, curcumin with black pepper, at the full dosage to create the result. If you want that additional benefit, take it with a meal. Take it with a healthy fat. I have tons of people who take it without. I take it without all the time.

But if you want that benefit additionally, you can take it that way. But I very much worry about that person in the end and how is this going to support them. And I don’t want any risk in that. So I see a big movement around liposomal curcumin. But again, we have to watch out for potency, rancidity, and all those kinds of issues.

Inna (34:26.989)

which just makes everything harder compliance-wise to remember too. yeah, that’s really helpful. And for everyone listening, Dr. Shivani actually was really gracious enough to give us a discount code for everyone. We’ll put that in the show notes so you guys can take a look at that. Now, let’s talk about gut health a little bit. We talked about curcumin and some of these other herbs and all the lifestyle factors for inflammation overall, but.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (34:31.598)

Correct. Absolutely.

Inna (34:53.579)

As you mentioned in our very medicine, the gut is the center of all things. think from a functional perspective, we all know and understand that the gut is a very central point of that too. So what are some of the things that people can do to support the gut? you know, I think again, most people know the basics, right? We want, we want to make sure we don’t have dysbiosis. We want to heal our guts so it’s not leaky. But what else? And especially for the different doshas, is it a different type of support when it comes to gut?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (35:23.662)

For sure. So in Ayurveda, we think of gut health, like I mentioned, as this gut digestive fire. And that gut digestive fire is the center of everything. So imagine inside of you, there’s this campfire. And if we maintain it, it’s a healthy, robust campfire that’s going to do what we’re asking it to do. When we go to eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner, we want that fire to open up, to really cook our food, process it. We want to assimilate and absorb the nutrition from that meal.

And then when we’re done, we wanna close that fire up. We don’t need high acid or high enzymes running around in the system. And we close that fire down to wait until our next meal. There’s a lot of issues with how we eat now in modern day society. A lot of times we are snacking all day, tiny meals, grabbing a bite here or there. We’re not really honoring that fire as a campfire. If you went to the forest and built a campfire right now, you would build it out of small, medium and large branches.

you would ignite that fire. You would build a boundary around it to really honor that fire and not let it go rampant. You would use that fire three times a day. You wouldn’t say, you know what, all day long, I’m just gonna mess with this fire and tinker with it and throw stuff in there and take it out. You would honor it. And so if we bring that same knowledge to ourselves, then we understand in the morning, what are my few practices to open up the campfire and get it going? That’s why we teach about tongue scraping. It’s igniting the digestive fire. We teach about ginger.

Inna (36:49.645)

I thought it was just to help get rid of the bacteria.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (36:51.138)

Yes, so tongue scraping is an in-

No, so tongue scraping is multifaceted from Ayurveda. Tongue scraping is gently scraping the tongue seven to 14 times with a copper tongue scraper. And we talk about looking at your tongue and understanding, do you have this ama or toxin burden throughout the body or any imbalances? So we teach that all the organs of the body are reflected on the tongue, just like in reflexology, they’re reflected on the bottom of the feet. And so by gently scraping the tongue, you’re massaging all the organs of the body.

Inna (36:58.027)

Mmm.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (37:24.258)

gently detoxing them, we’re igniting Digestifier, we’re waking it up for the day because we’re scraping the tongue and all those gut organs are reflected on the tongue. And then we’re also clearing oral microbiome, getting our taste buds to work better, and increasing better communication between oral microbiome and gut microbiome below. And so it’s really a simple 25 second, 30 second tool, but gives you like a 10x result in terms of results.

Inna (37:44.941)

fascinating.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (37:50.494)

So yeah, so when we talk about gut health, it’s like, are those morning practices? Hydration to create peristalsis. We talk about having a glass of water by your bedside table so you hydrate first and create that first bowel movement, which is so important. We talk about breath work and meditation, calming the nervous system, which supports gut health for the day. Copper tongue scraping. And you can even add in tools. If you’re constipated, we love aloe vera juice.

If you’re having a normal health, but you want to have ignited gut digestive fire, a stronger fire, you can have ginger lemon tea in the morning. That’s going to ignite things and get things moving and support digestive fire. We also teach practices throughout the day. So you wake up, get that fire going, eat your first meal, hold a big intermittent fast overnight. That’s also honoring the fire. So even a 12 hour fast is the basic one we teach, but you can go bigger. We teach to never drink ice water ever.

ever ever in IRV though. We don’t want you to get to a restaurant and say, you know what, before this amazing big meal, I’m just gonna pour a glass of ice water on my fire and turn it off before I eat. And so it sounds like a small thing, but what if you drink ice water at every lunch and dinner forever and you’re turning off the digestive fire? And in modern day language, we would call this digestive enzymes, our digestive acids. Do we have enough, you know, everything we need to process and absorb that food? And if we don’t,

Inna (38:50.921)

Hmm, yeah.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (39:13.442)

That’s what creates AMA, or this toxin residue in the system. And we’re not building resilience or that vitality that we want to have. We’re creating more dysbiosis. And so it’s a framework. It’s an understanding that that fire is the center of everything. And these little practices all add up to building the digestive fire and health that we want. Honoring those three meals a day. Eating, sitting down to eat them and taking a moment. Maybe it’s a prayer or maybe it’s just three deep breaths.

to drop into parasympathetic and really prepare that fire to receive that food and not be distracted by a tech or movies or whatever it is we’re watching and consuming. So we’re only consuming that food and communicating with it to receive the benefits. So that’s our approach to gut health is, that’s a like high level approach to gut health. In IRV that we go deeper and deeper into that topic, but it’s this understanding that everything evolves around the gut. And when you look at elemental design, like you asked about,

Vatthas have a tendency towards constipation. Bithas have a tendency to overdo, overconsume, overeat, and cause our own inflammation. And then Ghaffas can have a tendency towards feeling like a dullness or slowness in their gut digestifier because they’re more earth water. And so the homework is to really calibrate your meals, your meal timing, your meal sizes, what’s in your meals, eating a more circadian diet, and those little nuanced changes.

can create a huge result when it comes to the strength and the processing of that gut digestive fire.

Inna (40:47.789)

Yeah. And it makes so much sense when you explain it that way, where it’s like, it’s the fire that burns through everything. And I love what you were saying about honoring the fire, but then also letting it go down when you’re not eating. And that’s the problem I think so many of us eat before bed. We have snacks all the time. I mean, this is a conversation I with my kids all the time, but I’m like, stop snacking. We eat, then we stop.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (41:08.973)

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, or are we eating enough at our meals so we don’t want to snack? Like if I eat dinner and 20 minutes later, I really am munchy, I’m like, you didn’t eat enough. Are you eating enough healthy fat, enough fiber, enough protein? And so really paying attention to are we honoring the fire in that moment and then allowing it to close and do its job before we move on to the next thing?

Inna (41:33.579)

And is there anything that people need to do to sort of close the fire or is it just stopping to eat that does that?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (41:40.27)

I would say it’s stopping to eat. Nowadays we’re talking about switching activities like walking for 10 to 15 minutes. So in IRB though, we taught about once you’re done eating, walk around, wrap things up, move around a little bit, don’t lay down. You can’t take that fire and then just lay it down and expect it to do its job. We’re not gonna have peristalsis. It’s not gonna come all the way down the system to the fire where we need it to do its job. And so there were a lot of conversations around simple, healthy practices. we know those.

but sometimes we’re still not practicing them. Sometimes we’re still just running off doing the next thing. Sometimes we’re eating while driving. So it’s really about like when dinner’s done, which is hopefully by seven, then you’ve moved around, done the rest of your day, digested that meal fully, far before bedtime. And then on the circadian clock, we teach 10 to two is when the body repairs. So we know through modern science that we have the melatonin release at 10. Ayurveda said 10 to two is twice as important.

than all the other sleep you’re gonna get that night. It’s when the lymphatic system, glymphatic system, all of it clears out, gut health is repaired, everything gets repaired for the next day. And so we teach a lot about finished dinner on time, close up shop, no munching, no nothing. You can have a deep sleep tea, like a sleep hygiene ritual around tea before bed, but that’s it. And then come next morning, start your day with self care, with your rhythm, so the body knows what to expect, and create that 12 hour fast.

before you open the fire and start the day.

Inna (43:10.379)

Yeah. And those are things that overall are pretty simple to do. For everyone listening, it’s small things, but my gosh, I mean, they really yield big results, especially when kind of doing it together with everything else and all the anti-inflammatory tools too. So what would you say, you know, for someone dealing with Hashimoto’s who is, you know, they may know their type just from everything that you so graciously explained here. If you can give them three tips.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (43:24.707)

Absolutely.

Inna (43:39.309)

to help to over or lower the inflammation and help that autoimmune burden, what would be your top three? I we talked about so many different things, but what would be your top three?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (43:49.485)

I would say my first one is lemon ginger tea in the morning. Let’s get the fire going because if that fire is on and churning and burning, it’s gonna support you in clearing any toxin burden that already exists. Most of us are sitting on some sort of past toxin burden. And then it’s also strengthening digestive fire in the here and now. And we know gut health is hormone health. So if we start with that practice first, I think that’s a really key one. Another important one is eat your biggest meal at midday.

So when we talk about circadian clock and the elemental designs, we talk about how you wake up in the morning in the Vata time of day, preferably between two and six a.m. And during that time, do some self-care, whether it’s meditation, journaling, breath work, just going outside and moving the sunlight, anything like that. Six to 10 a.m. is Gaffa time of day, time to get moving, get your exercise and energy moving. But what we teach is 10 to two, just like at night is the Bitta time of day and those fires clean and clear.

During the day, we have the most support to eat our biggest meal of the day and absorb the nutrition from it. So just the practice of a bigger lunch and putting your super foods in the 10 to two window with lunch can be really powerful. A lot of times we have a habit nowadays of dinner being the biggest meal because we get home, we’re hungry, we want that big dinner. And so we recommend lunch. Now we talk about three square meals a day. If you’re a Bitha like me, you might need four.

So I usually need a big snack between lunch and dinner. That’s okay too, but just make sure we’re not munching constantly. So that’s why we talk about that largest meal at lunchtime, because we’re most supported to absorb and digest it. And then another thing we talk about is lights off by 10 PM. Supporting that hormone rhythm is so important. So many of us are, especially if you’re a Pitta, we’re burning the candle at both ends. There’s always more work to do, always more emails to reply to or DMs. And so,

this idea of honoring 10 p.m. as bedtime or as close to it as you can is really important. What many people do is they think they’re night owls. They say, you know what, I just get my best work done at night. And for that crew, I say, look, it’s your bit the fire. I know if I see 11 11 on my clock at night, I’m like, that’s it. You’re going to be up all night. You’re going to stay up till two. You’re getting your second wind and you’re using it for brain energy instead of detox energy. And so just remembering that

Inna (46:05.453)

Thank

Dr. Shivani Gupta (46:14.146)

Bringing in sleep hygiene tools at night, whether it’s dry brushing, we teach about a pyeong massage. It’s a self massage using food grade organic oils to settle down our vata energy, which so many of us do struggle with the vata energy right now, is a really powerful tool. Or a hot bath, hot shower, anything you can do to really settle the nervous system before bed and creating that opportunity for good sleep will support our hormone health and our gut health.

and thus give us everything else we want. So I teach a lot about sleep teas and adaptogens and everything we can do because I know we’re leading busy lives and we need to support that hormone health, but sometimes we need tools to help us get there.

Inna (46:55.437)

Yeah, absolutely. But that’s so helpful. You mentioned also lunch is the biggest meal because you can absorb things and obviously you have time to digest. Is that also the time that you would recommend taking something like curcuma or other supplements because of the absorption?

Dr. Shivani Gupta (47:09.24)

Yeah, actually that’s a great idea. I never thought of it that way. But yeah, I mean, I think those supplements is twice a day, morning and afternoon, morning and evening. But yes, we are most supported to digest and absorb everything at lunch. So making sure one big set of your supplements is happening at lunchtime is also very supportive.

Inna (47:30.713)

and you know, of course not everything interferes, but you just never know what things can interfere. A lot of us take our supplements like for thyroid love, we always recommend lunch and dinner. So you’re getting that lunch, but that’s good to know that that can be helpful. Dr. Shivani, this is so helpful. Thank you so much for being here. Now for everyone listening, can you just share, first of all, where can they get your book? I know it just launched, which is really exciting. So share where they can get it. And also if they want to connect with you and contact you, how they can do that.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (47:42.827)

shirt.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (48:00.102)

for So my website is my name, shavanigupta.com and on there you’ll find all my information. My social media handles are at doctor.shavanigupta on Instagram and I’m on Facebook and YouTube as well. So you can reach me through the site, through social media. I have the inflammation code book there and my podcast is the inflammation.

Inna (48:24.045)

Well, thank you so much for being here and for giving us all this information. it’s going to be so helpful for so many people and I look forward to staying connected with you.

Dr. Shivani Gupta (48:32.824)

Thank you, you as well. Thanks for having me.